Regalia - what form does it take in Dragon Age?

[varelishawt]

Okay, so I've been thinking about this on and off - we know that, even though we don't see it in the game, Alistair and Anora presumably have crowns, given all the references to "I'll take the crown". But do the other nobles have any regalia at all? Maybe not as fancy as these collars of office, but something like it for maybe the teyrn and arls? The lower the rank, of course, the less fancy it gets, probably. They also had livery collars, maybe worn by those part of a coalition of nobles.

The reason I'm posting this here is if you guys think it's plausible for the Warden-Commander to wear one, as he/she is also the arl/arlessa of Amaranthine. I think they would definitely wear these things in Orlais, but I am unsure about Ferelden - much is made of the pragmatism and practicality of Fereldans.

Comments

[niniane]

I'm guessing that any regalia that exists in Ferelden is pretty limited just in that they seem to be a poor country with a somewhat chaotic governing body. While I definitely see Orlais having regalia, sumptory laws, etc. I'm guessing that Ferelden did not.

That said, if you go for it, I think that it would make perfect sense for a Warden to wear whatever the Arl/Arlessa regalia was for formal events. (Although he/she might hate it!)

[biffmclaughlin]

I like the idea of there being regalia, and think it's likely there would be. I would have to agree with niniane's assessment, certainly with respect to the jewelled regalia. If it already existed, as a treasured relic handed down over the ages, it would be a prime target for theft, that's for sure, but I don' think they'd be creating any at this point. And this has just given me an idea, so thank you for asking!

However, there could be special robes, made with rarer fabrics and colors poorer people couldn't afford? I did a bit of research in that regard recently. It's a thought, if you're looking for something that's still plausible and yet not extravagantly expensive.

[niniane]

I could see something, but I'd assume that it would be fairly modest. Possibly along the lines of a special stripe or collar or something. I'd imagine that it would be more along the lines of what was worn by good Roman Republicans (i.e. a fancy bit of cloth with the stripes along the bottom indicating how wealthy you were/your political rank) rather than something super special. I could be wrong, but the historical analogue seems closer to me there than, say, big shiny crowns. (Also, even at Alistair's/Anora's coronation, we don't see them wearing anything fancy. Fereldans really are pretty boring I think...although some of this might be lazy programming. Then again, we see the dwarfs get a crown...)

[amhran_comhrac]

I never understood the choice for the crown. It seems far too delicate for their culture. In my mind the crown looks more like the one from Polanski's version of Macbeth. Something more heavy and primitive.

[niniane]

Possibly. Then again, the dwarfs do like solid handiwork, so I'm not sure that I'd see something really rugged as working for them. But, yeah, the one in game was pretty goofy. Quite gaudy. It looked like what a 6 year old playing princess would want. ;)

[amhran_comhrac]

Ooh, no I was thinking about the Ferelden crown, Alistair's little circlet. It seemed a bit too dainty for a bunch of dog loving barbarians.
The dwarven crown is such a hot mess I can't even begin to describe what could be done to fix it other than "melt and start over."

[niniane]

Oh, am braindead today. But yeah, I agree. Fereldens need big, hoking crowns.

And the dwarf crown...has problems. Then again, I suppose that dwarfs like the gaudy. Or something. Maybe in the darkness, you can't see crowns unless they're very big and filled with gems?

[varelishawt]

I don't remember Alistair wearing a circlet...

[darkrose]

I refer to it as the Lego Crown. I suspect Caradin meant it as an insult--that's the only way it makes sense.

[varelishawt]

As of right now, I gave my commander a sash to wear at special social or ceremonial occasions, midnight blue with the two griffons of her rank emblazoned on it. It's the only bit of color and fanciness she would willingly wear.

[varelishawt]

Yes, it would be much less ostentatious than anything an Orlesian would dream up. I'm thinking a silverite badge on a ribbon. There could be jokes about it being a collar to control the commander, or a choke collar, giving her/him enough rope to hang himself with, etc. The possibilities are endless. :)

[niniane]

That could work quite well. And I love the idea of "enough rope to hang himself with". ;)

[valiasedai]

Eh... maybe given a couple of centuries. I don't really see them using anything fancier/blingier than a signet ring which doubles as a seal. Their practicality comes out of necessity, not simple desire for it, and I think it would be a while before they start devoting time/energy into specific marks of office that are that much of a waste of resources in terms of material wealth. I never get the sense that the nobility is particularly wealthy at this point.

[varelishawt]

Well, as I said, it wouldn't be crazy ostentatious as the ones in the pictures, just more, I don't know, sensible and plain? Instead of gold and jewels, it could be of silverite. It just seems to me that, given the way nobles had so little to differentiate them from peasants besides clothes, they would use these chains of office.

[amhran_comhrac]

Signet rings are cannon, actually. That's what Teagan gives you to unlock the door to the passage into castle redcliffe.

[jannifer]

You might think in terms of a circlet rather than a crown or diadem also. I like the idea of a sash for military orders such as the Wardens. Perhaps the nobles would wear something like a ceremonial cloak rather than specific clothing. A cloak could be the half circle kind that goes only over one shoulder and be fairly short in the ban's or arl's colors with his/her emblem embroidered and appliqued on it. Fabric could vary depending on the noble's wealth -- anything from fine Ferelden wool to Orlesian silks to Navarran velvets. Circlets don't require as much metal as heavier crowns and could be made from silverite, bronze, silver, gold or even well-crafted dragonbone. There could actually be two signet rings (which was common) -- a personal and/or family ring and another ring of rank. In other words, Alistair would have his personal seal, perhaps of the Theirin family, and the monarch's seal. While Wardens do leave family ties behind when they Join, it wouldn't be unreasonable for a Warden Commander to design or have designed a personal seal with some symbol important to him/her. I think Anders' should have a depiction of the Tower fronted by a Templar shield, don't you? *wicked grin*

[varelishawt]

Hm, that cloak would be awfully warm in high summer, LOL. The reason I didn't say circlets or diadems for the lesser nobles is that I'm afraid they might be misconstrued, you know, for wanting the crown.

My commander did have two signet rings, one for Grey Warden business, with the two griffons, and her Cousland ring, but Fergus asked for it back, that meanie.

[sleepyowlet]

I went with livery collars for Teyrns and Arls in my fic. The Grey Wardens... well, they're so notorious and independent - I don't think they would need any signs of office other than the griffin/double griffin in their heraldry. Signet rings are very likely too, I guess.
King: crown.

[varelishawt]

Aha, someone else who thought about livery collars. :D I agree with you about the Wardens, but the WC is a special case, so I think he/she would wear something that reflected the fact that he/she is arl/essa. Though my WC stresses the fact that she is a Grey Warden first, and arlessa second.

[darkrose]

We do know that the Fereldens use heraldry, so I've always figured that on formal occasions, you wear something in the appropriate color. I also tend to imagine my WC as wearing armor, because even though she's the arlessa, that title is secondary, in a way, to her being the Commander of the Grey.

[varelishawt]

Yep, my commander wears armor all the time, too, for those formal/ceremonial occasions. Poor Varel has to try to persuade her to wear a dress to be less intimidating, but she figures, "Duncan would never wear anything but his armor. If it was good enough for him, it's good enough for me." The only concession she'll make is the sash and the collar.

[biffmclaughlin]

So this got me to thinking...if you're following me on FF, minor spoiler alert here for the next instalment, but nothing related to the major plot. Gone now? Okay...

Let's say the Ferelden arls and banns do wear livery collars, something super flashy with lots of jewels and gold and hoo ha hey. And let's say the arling is in a state and the arl's looking at the gaudy collar thinking it could turn a fair bit of coin or whatever else one might think to justify selling it. How many sovereigns do you think it's worth, either as a whole or in pieces?

[varelishawt]

Well, first of all, I don't think they'd wear anything that flashy, it seems OOC.

If you did the quest Crime Wave in DA:O, the teyrn's crown sold for 12 sovereigns. I would imagine the livery collar would go for something similar, if it were whole.

Depending on how many links, what type of jewels adorned it, the precious metal involved, a link may go for 1 to 3 sovereigns.

[biffmclaughlin]

Hmmm...good point and not quite what I was hoping for. :-) The kicker on that Crime Wave bit was that I sold the crown to Levi and noticed later that I could buy it back for 57 sovereign or something like that. Bummer, but that's the way it goes, of course.

I suppose I could make something of the fact that Howe was a self-obsessed jerk who wouldn't have thought much about splurging on himself or hoarding wealth to bump the value up a few sovereigns.

Cheers,
Biff

[varelishawt]

Well, Loghain seems like a practical man, enough that his crown would reflect that austerity. So you've got enough leeway to have the livery collar being sold for something much higher than just 12 sovereigns.